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Patty
08-19-2010, 07:03 PM
I was talking with someone today and I said that my oldest grandson lives on a lake and will swim back and forth across it. Then it hit me. Shouldn't it be forth and back? After all, you can't come back until you go forth, no? It is "to and fro", but not forth and back...Just struck me as backwards. There must be a name for that kind of phrase, anyone know what it would be??:twitcy:

MidwestStamper
08-19-2010, 07:19 PM
Never thought about it that way, but you do have a point. I'll have to ask my son Daniel what he thinks, since he's going to be an English major...!

Paula Carden
08-19-2010, 08:55 PM
it is a oxymoron isn't it. Swims to and fro -forth and back just doesn't work back and forth because it is alphabetical-I don't have a clue but funny you thought about it. Now I will too.

suzi_f
08-19-2010, 09:04 PM
I've always hated the phrase "head over heels". I don't know about y'all but my head is ALWAYS over my heels as my heels are on my feet. Wouldn't heels over head make more sense????

cindi
08-19-2010, 09:13 PM
ok, on this same line..am I the only one that takes something out of the freezer to "unthaw" it?? a friend pointed out to me a few weeks ago that unthawing is incorrect!! geez I have said that my whole life!
:)

KarenM
08-19-2010, 09:15 PM
You're both right. It should be forth and back and heals over head. Weird!!

Mrs. Fence
08-19-2010, 10:15 PM
You girls are hilarious!!!!!

maxiesmom
08-19-2010, 10:44 PM
ok, on this same line..am I the only one that takes something out of the freezer to "unthaw" it?? a friend pointed out to me a few weeks ago that unthawing is incorrect!! geez I have said that my whole life!
:)

Now that you mention it I'm sure I must have, but I guess we are just thawing and not unthawing. If it were unthawed, it would still be frozen. :goofy:

Patty
08-19-2010, 11:21 PM
it is a oxymoron isn't it. Swims to and fro -forth and back just doesn't work back and forth because it is alphabetical-I don't have a clue but funny you thought about it. Now I will too.

Hi Paula--I don't know about oxymoron--I thought that was like a contradiction within itself, like military intelligence for example. The only thing I can think to call back and forth is that its a** backwards. Where are all our English majors? or grammar experts??? (actually, when I was working I had a young man with a communications degree on my team. One day, after reading several of his emails, I asked him if he ever had to take a grammar class and his answer to me was "uhhhh, what's grammar?")

Patty
08-19-2010, 11:26 PM
I've always hated the phrase "head over heels". I don't know about y'all but my head is ALWAYS over my heels as my heels are on my feet. Wouldn't heels over head make more sense????

Suzi--you are absolutely right--why didn't I ever notice that??? head over heels, hmph, how did that get past me!!!

Paula Carden
08-20-2010, 06:59 AM
I don't think unthaw is really a word. At least I had a teacher to tell me that many years ago. I also thought that was only a southern term but it must not be since you use it in the north too.
My mom and dad always said unthaw so....as Patty said we need our grammar experts-

suzi_f
08-20-2010, 07:47 AM
Ok, what about "over a barrell"? You got me over a barrell meaning you've got me trapped??? Uh if you're OVER the barrell, you're free to go. If you were UNDER the barrell, you'd be stuck.

Erin K
08-20-2010, 09:22 AM
Ok, what about "over a barrell"? You got me over a barrell meaning you've got me trapped??? Uh if you're OVER the barrell, you're free to go. If you were UNDER the barrell, you'd be stuck.

I thought "over a barrell" had.... um... sexual connotations?

Now you know the way MY mind works! sheesh.

I've never heard the term "unthaw" but look: http://www.audioenglish.net/dictionary/unthaw.htm

Yall are right. WEIRD.

Course "flamable" and "Inflamable" mean the same thing too. Weird English language.

Patty
08-20-2010, 09:42 AM
Well well well, Erin...your take on the barrell is very interesting---that NEVER would have come to MY mind...hmmm, something to think about today!!

and holy cow! about dethaw---Cindy===you were right all along---I'm gonna have to read more on that one--thanks for the link, Erin.

MidwestStamper
08-20-2010, 09:58 AM
I think some of these are called 'idioms' which are sayings that are unique to a language, that can't really be explained, but people know what they mean:

IDIOM:
A speech form or an expression of a given language that is peculiar to itself grammatically or cannot be understood from the individual meanings of its elements, as in 'keep tabs on'.
The specific grammatical, syntactic, and structural character of a given language. Regional speech or dialect.

-A specialized vocabulary used by a group of people; jargon: legal idiom.
-A style or manner of expression peculiar to a given people
-A style of artistic expression characteristic of a particular individual, school, period, or medium: the idiom of the French impressionists; the punk rock idiom.

I know that when my Mom went to Language School in Columbia to learn Spanish, she was taught that once you've mastered the language then it's necessary to learn the local 'idioms' so that you sound comfortable with the language and not so formal.

Some other English ones are:
"Green with envy", "I'm feeling blue", "I'm feeling under the weather', "Cat got your tongue?"...and tons of others!

tojoco
08-20-2010, 10:02 AM
But yet the meaning of "thaw" is:

to pass or change from a frozen to a liquid or semiliquid state; melt. So go figure!

MidwestStamper
08-20-2010, 10:02 AM
Erin and Suzi, since you made me curious about the saying "Over a barrell" I decided to 'google' it:

"This is an American phrase and first appeared in the mid-20th century. It is supposed that it alludes to the actual situation of being draped over a barrel, either to empty the lungs of someone who has been close to drowning, or to give a flogging. Either way, the position of helplessness and in being under someone else's control is what is being referred to."

Christie
08-20-2010, 10:24 AM
I thought "over a barrell" had.... um... sexual connotations?

Now you know the way MY mind works! sheesh.

I've never heard the term "unthaw" but look: http://www.audioenglish.net/dictionary/unthaw.htm

Yall are right. WEIRD.

Course "flamable" and "Inflamable" mean the same thing too. Weird English language.

It's funny how we can live in the same country but still have never heard certain terms. Unthaw here is commonly used but I never really thought much about that word. Maybe from now on I'll just say "it isn't thawed yet"

loobylou
08-20-2010, 10:33 AM
I use all of these sayings too- Except for unthaw. I say "defrost".

Patty
08-20-2010, 12:33 PM
Lidia--what you said makes perfect sense to me. I find the English language very interesting---especially where terms/phrases come from. I've heard it said that the English language is very hard to learn. I guess these are good examples of why that is!

ccstampin12
08-20-2010, 02:17 PM
I was an English major along with my Elementary Ed. degree.
But I don't ever recall having to know this!
There was a fun 'thing' on line since forever about English being the hardest language to learn because there are so many tricky things to know.
There are hilarious examples of these...
Like you 'read' a book now, but you 'read' it yesterday.
Things like that.
I wonder how we could find that....
It would be interesting to see that again!
Joanie

Patty
08-20-2010, 04:11 PM
Yeah--that's the stuff I'm talking about--I'm really bad about these things--not only do my kids do this now, but my grandchildren pick up on mistakes and things that don't make sense!!! I guess you could say that "my work is done"!!! At least in this area!

maxiesmom
08-20-2010, 06:00 PM
This has been a very interesting thread. And yes, Joanie is correct, I have heard often over the years how difficult English is to learn.